HttK rules questions

[GVL]

HttK is a beautiful game, but we have some rules questions that we didn't find in the errata.
Who can answer some rules questions about HttK?

1) Exclusive rules : nr 204 : The VP for the "Ratios of total Strenght Lost" in this paragraph are unclear :

Russian:French 1:2, 1.5:1, 1:1, 1:1.5
The French VP : -2 , -1 , +1 , +2

Do we have to change the 1.5:1 and the 1:1.5?
Otherwise, it is not logic.

2) Standard Rules : nr 184 : " Artillery units in a Force are the first to take losses due to Pursuit"

Does the Artillery have to suck up all the losses before an other unit has to take losses? Are does it mean that the Artillery has to take the first Loss of SP and the next is for the other units?

3) Standard Rules : nr 152 : " ...,but only one Force may attack this same defending hex "

against

nr 187 : " In the event of two enemy Forces losing a battle to a single Force,..."

Doesn't the rule 152 imply that it is impossible to have a fight between two Forces on the one hand and one Force on the other hand?

Or are there some circumstances where it might be possible?

Thanks to anyone who wants to answer these questions.

[kzucker]

1) Yes.

2) Artillery takes the first (single) point of loss.

3) There are cases where it might be possible.

[GVL]

3) There are cases where it might be possible.

Which are these special cases?

Could you take a look to my question about Lewis in the thread before this?

[kzucker]

This Q&A includes the question and answer about Lewis (scroll down).

Attrition to Besieged Forces (Campaign only - addition)
[59.] (change) however, an Attrition die roll Modifier of +5 also applies to Besieged Forces.' (add) The besieged forces will consume their supplies and thereby reduce the Forage Value of the hex. Roll each turn of the siege (except the first), prior to resolving attrition, to see if there will be a reduction in Forage Value. If you roll higher than the current forage rating, the forage rating will be reduced by one henceforth. Example: On the first turn of siege, a die roll of one through four will mean no reduction in forage value. If the siege is broken the forage value of the citadel returns to 4 and the citadel is considered revictualed. Besieging forces may also forage (the Forage Value reduction in their hex and the +5 modifier do not apply because they have access to the surrounding countryside).

From: "Coley Cowan" <ccowan@siumed.edu>

Thanks for the response on my siege question. We have started a campaign
game, and the new method worked well on Riga. Fell to the French in
about 6 turns I think. Of course the Russians burned it to the ground,
and I lost a point, but................

My new questions:

Q) Does the 48 point stacking limit still apply. Did not see it
anywhere. Probably just missed it.

A) Yes!

Q) Sieges (again) - Like I said, playing a campaign game. Got to Smolensk on about turn 12. Should not have, I am strung-out all over the roads, the result of trying to chase down Bagration without success.

Anyway, went ahead and got to Smolensk to start the siege as early as
possible, and think I have another problem.

Smolensk is a depot hex, and the French need the depot to extend their
LOC. Unless and until Smolensk falls, then you cannot really
head to Moscow. Well, you can get part way, but not all the way. I think
you could get your center of Ops just short of Smolensk and then have
your dispatch distance of 7MP's past that. So you run out of supply line
just shy of Borodino. You would have to forage to get to Moscow; something I am reluctant to do. I also do not see any alternate supply line nearby.

Is this intended ? Is it either forage your way to Moscow, or sit down
and wait until Smolensk falls and then advance. If you wait, it may be
6-10 turns before you move on. That is pushing it late in the season.
And does not reflect the historical timetable. It may be turn 25 before you
even get to Moscow. And you probably want to know what happened to
Smolensk before you decide to march on Moscow. Do you need the points
or not?

Smolensk was not besieged historically (I don't think, maybe I am wrong), should it be a citadel at all? Then the Russians either fight (which they did historically ) or the French just take it.

What do you think? Should I just start foraging? Or should Smolensk not be a citadel ?

A) Smolensk is definitely a citadel. A force besieged in a citadel cannot block an LOC, not even one going through the hex. (However, note that [102.b] requires Riga to be captured and garrisoned before it can function as a Supply Source.)

Given that French 12-pounders were unable to breach the city's walls, Napoleon halted the planned assault against them. His troops had merely taken the suburbs when Barclay ordered the town abandoned. Bennigsen and Constantine accused Barclay of throwing away a glorious victory. Barclay did not garrison the citadel as he pulled out; perhaps he felt he could not spare the troops.

Q) Does that mean I can enter the Smolensk hex while the citadel is besieged ?

A) Yes.

Q) And garrison the depot, and keep going ?

A) Yes. Place the depot on top of the besieged enemy force.

When do I roll on the "Fire" table? When the city is occupied? Or when the
citadel falls?

A) When the city is occupied.

Q) when Riga/Smolensk/Moscow are captured during the campaign game, does
the Paris Morale track change by a) 1 (para 205 exclusive rules) plus variable from fire table (para 165 exclusive rules) or b) variable from fire table (para 165 exclusive rules) only?

A) Ignore the last two sentences in para 205. (This is provisional and subject to change, depending upon play balancing considerations.)

Q) Is there a forage value for Duchy of Warsaw and Prussia?

A) Prussia [2], Grand Duchy [1], Also the province of Livonia [2], east of the Gulf of Riga, and Volhynia [2], south of the Pripyat Marshes.

Q) This is a very well presented game and I look forward to playing it.
Thanks in advance for your responses and can you tell me if you have
a release date for your Spanish theatre study?

A) Thanks for your kind comments. We have not yet begun to accept pre-orders for the Spanish game. We shall have to do a preliminary prototype, then post the notice on the web.

From: "coley cowan" <coleyc@onemain.com>

Q) Capture in battle: If you wipe out a force, is the capture of all leaders
automatic? Or do you roll against initiative to see if they escape?
A) You get to roll, as explained in the Standard Rules [33].

Q) Army leaders - I sent Davout down to take Reynier and Austrians and Junot
under command. Thought he could destroy Tormassov, Tchichagov (sp?). My
opponent then decided to make their "6 span" leaders unemployed and turn
everything over to Sacken who is a "5". That way he would avoid the capture
and the loss of points if and when I wiped out their forces. Any penalty for
doing that ? Or is it perfectly legal.
A) You would still gain a morale point per Standard [193]. That command change could only occur during your opponent's Command Phase.

Q) Alternate supply lines. Rules state you only have to trace a depot to ANY
supply source, not the active one. Does that mean that the southern Russian
forces can trace to any road edge ? Just have to have a depot within 18 of
the map-edge, and create depots after that ? And get to roll for attrition
using the accumulated AP's ? Adjusted for the length of line of course. same
for MacDonald at Riga. Once taken he has a supply source there. Does he use
the accumulated A/P's for attrition there ?
A) Yes to all questions, but see the Exclusive Rules [103].

Q) How pretty/regular does your line have to be ? Do you have to have a
depot every 9 hexes ? or can it have gaps ?

Example: Say the main French line. Could you build 4 depots early in the
chain (say Kovno, Vilna, Asmjany, Molodechno) which would allow you to go 36
additional hexes (plus 18) . This would get you to past Smolensk. Could you
then build another at Smolensk later, and would that be a legal supply line.
Even though there is a big gap between the "links " in the chain ?

A) Gaps are not permitted. The distance between any two depots cannot exceed 9 MPs; the range of wagons travelling from one depot to the next.

If you are curious, the Russians burnt every city, Nappy got one victory in
battle. Davout got Tormassov, but then the Russians got rid of Tchichagov,
so could not get another point chsing him down. Even worse he sent him to
cut my supply line in two places (went and took over a major general and
attacked my garrrisons). Davout had most of the "rear area troops" WAY down
south, so it was vulnerable. Poniatowski and Victor could not react in time.
They were the only ones around. Maybe 2 major offensives was a bad idea,
when you are overstretched already ?

So in Moscow, minus 1 morale. Tsar almost talked to me (rolled one "11"),
but then refused. I gave.

from: "Brent Cooper" <bcooper@kc.rr.com>

Q) The Kosinski (Polish Militia) unit is missing. Is it possible that it wasn't there to begin with?
A) Kosinski was deleted from the counter mix (see #32 in the 'Highway to the Kremlin Update' emailed on 3/26/01).

Q) How can Lewis start under Essen's command on 24 June and still be a reinforcement for 29 July? According to my sources (Nafziger, "Napoleon's Invasion of Russia" and Riehn, "1812: Napoleon's Russian Campaign") General Lewis was part of the Riga garrison commanded by Essen. As per Riehn, Lewis' force started the campaign on 24 June in Mitau (W1205), and Essen was commanding only garrison troops. Nafzinger states that Lewis was part of the Riga garrison but specifies no location. So in conclusion, I believe that an accurate modification would be to remove Lewis from the reinforcement track but have him start at Mitau.

A) This suggested change to the Set-Up and Reinforcement Track is approved.

Notes: a) Exclusive Rules [43], etc. The list of provinces in the severe winter snow region should include Vitebsk and Pskov. b) The towns of Tilsit (E0317) and Szillen (E0318) should be connected by Primary road. c) When playing the Battle Scenarios, please use Exclusive rules [102] and [107].

[GVL]

Q) How can Lewis start under Essen's command on 24 June and still be a reinforcement for 29 July? According to my sources (Nafziger, "Napoleon's Invasion of Russia" and Riehn, "1812: Napoleon's Russian Campaign") General Lewis was part of the Riga garrison commanded by Essen. As per Riehn, Lewis' force started the campaign on 24 June in Mitau (W1205), and Essen was commanding only garrison troops. Nafzinger states that Lewis was part of the Riga garrison but specifies no location. So in conclusion, I believe that an accurate modification would be to remove Lewis from the reinforcement track but have him start at Mitau.

A) This suggested change to the Set-Up and Reinforcement Track is approved.

].

Kevin,

Lewis is not a Leader counter and cannot be on the map in Mittau.
On the map, there are only Leader counters.
Isn't that the game-system?
Or do we need a new Leader counter for Lewis?

[kzucker]

Yes, we do need a leader counter for Lewis. It's called a Major General.

[GVL]

Yes, we do need a leader counter for Lewis. It's called a Major General.

Ok. Thanks. Good game system.
Some other rules questions will follow.

[Wallenstein]

Yes, we do need a leader counter for Lewis. It's called a Major General.

OK, but every Major General is already in use and what unit will stay with ESSEN? Or maybe put Essen and Lewis in Mitau?

[Wallenstein]

Kevin
Any chance to receive answer for above question?

[kzucker]

Place Lewis counter on the map in Mitau and treat as a garrison (static unit). Once a leader passes through the hex or a Major General counter comes available then the Lewis counter can be placed on the Leader track.

[Wallenstein]

OK, so ESSEN stays with garrison in Riga?

[kzucker]

Yes Yes Yes.

[daniel C]

Kevin
I am playing HTTK and will soon begin Crossroads but the system I definitely prefer is the 1x. So I have 2 questions about HTTK
1/ A russian force with 5 SP is attacked while in a citadel. It takes 2 losses in the first attack but doesn't counter attack. In the second round, as the force falls to 3 SP, can russian player choose to become besieged?
2/ if russian doesn't decide to be besieged, can french player decide to make no further attack and stop here?
Thanks

[kzucker]

The Russian player has that choice.

The French player must attack in that case.

[daniel C]

Hello Kevin
new problem arises during our game.
french force occupies a fortified town
a russian force enter its ZOC with the objective to attack the city
during french forced march, french succeed with its die roll and left the EZOC but stays in the fortified town
It seems illogical but is it forbidden? can french force escape to the russian attack?

[kzucker]

Is it not logical...? Try to imagine it.

[daniel C]

Kevin
I cannot imagine that the french force can hinder russian force to attack. french force is statical because it is behind fortifications
Daniel

[kzucker]

NEXT turn the Russians may attack the fort.

[Roger55]

Maybe I missed it but a Word or PDF file for the Battle worksheet would be nice. Of course, I'm too lazy to type one up myself.:D

[kzucker]

Cool! You use it?!

[Roger55]

Yes I use it.:rolleyes: It means you don't have to keep all the stuff in your head. I can't do that anymore at my advanced age.

Going for the easy solution I took a photo this afternoon of the page, and after croping and changing the contrast, I got a a sort of centered version of the form. Hard to center a page in a the view finder of my cheap digital camera (got it for nothing--a real bare bones operation here).:cool:

I was using a grease pencil (china marker) on a page cover with the form inside, but the grease pencil is down to a stub (I use it for other wargame forms the same way) so I've been trying to find a way to print forms up.

A PDF file would sure look better than this photo version, though.;)

Besides, I want use the form for Napoleon at the Crossroads.

[kzucker]

Roger,

I would love to send you a pdf of that page but I cannot seem to find it. There should be one around but I don't know the file name.

Anyway got your order for HoV ... Thanks!

[Roger55]

Napoleon at the Crossroads and Habit of Victory (now I await both;)) are consulations for my inability to get enough table space for Struggle of Nations (AH) and The Eagles turn East 1807 (CoA). I put all the leader tracks for SoN on heavy board (had to chop them in two) so I could put them under the table, on chairs and on top of small filing cabinets; so we could use the dining room table to lay out the charts and rules. I can't imagine the hex sheets printed full size. Sorry I liked the little hexes. I thought the two hex "packages" could have been better designed but that was minor as compared to the space the displays took up.

When TETE came I almost went nuts. The three sheets just fit on the table and I was faced with mounting the leader tracks again. It got punched and the rules got read, but I could never set it up. The campaign analysis was pretty informative:).

Layed out HttK today using a Card table and two 2X3 canvas boards. Maybe we will try a scenario this weekend instead of a marathon campaign session, like the last two times. Of course, the whole set up is jammed into a corner so each player gets to sit only while he's phasing:(.

I remember this puppy, HttK, as a sort of slow motion nightmare. These two mappers always make me wish for little hexes and two hex packages.

You can't imagine our delight when GMT came out with a one map Borodino and Austerlitz even though we have to draw chits:p. That GDW Borodino and Gamers Austerlitz made me and my regulars crazy.

I guess I either get a better picture of the form or sit down and grind through creating a Word Document of this "player aid."

[daniel C]

hello Kevin
a new question because we meet difficult terrain :
My opponent let the question on consimworld too
Here is the situation. Eugene is sitting in Mogilev (which is a fortress), Ney is backing him up in a adjoining hex (clear terrain). Bagration seing this decides to attack Ney. Eugene force marches to the rescue of Ney but without leaving his hex (since he is already next to Bagration). So now Bagration has both Ney and Eugene in his ZOC. The question is: do the French benefit from the Mogilev fortress? (affecting terrain and doubling of 3 SP).

The rules say that if a force attacks several hexes the best terrain for the defender is chosen. Is it still the case in this situation (does one consider that Bagration has indeed attacked Mogilev)?
daniel

[kzucker]

The french benefit from the fortress is limited to 5 SPs in the fortress (doubled).

[daniel C]

But to take part in the fight, Eugene must left the protection of fortifications
and the russian has no intention to attack them.
French benefit anyway from fortifications?

[kzucker]

Hi Daniel,

This is up to the French player. He will have to declare whether he remains in the citadel or not.